The idea that values persist acros generations is critical here. Looking at the neo-Europe examples, its clear that institutions dont just emerge from geography or resources alone but from the people who build them. The spaghetti theory resonates because we do meet in the midlle more often than we fully asimilate. Policy makers should weigh both individual credentials and ancestral outcomes when considering immigration.
I don't think you need to coin the phrase “The Spaghetti Theory of Cultural Change” when a very famous term already exists for what you're describing: The Melting-Pot. This is indeed one of the great virtues of immigration, which is why the term is generally perceived with such a positive valence.
Actually I did need to coin the phrase because as I note in Culture Transplant the term Melting Pot is now a dead metaphor: it now only means assimilation by immigrants to the new nation's norms.
Sometimes you have to acknowledge that a once-great line is now a dead expression.
And Spaghetti Theory highlights the reverse assimilation effect, which needs highlighting.
I'm glad that Dwarkesh brought it up on his podcast with Henrich, for example.
One does not need to do extensive studies to see that smart immigration policy is superior to the development or even survival of a nation. One needs only look at the benefit/harm that individual immigrants bring to their local families and communities. Ask any American or European who married someone who practices Sharia law and they will tell you that Islam not only does NOT make America better, it actually undermines our nation while harming those involved. One can then look at the nations around the Mediterranean before and after the Arab invasions and forced conversions to Islam and see that most of the effects on these societies were profoundly negative. One could do a study on the settlement of large numbers of Somalis in Minnesota has not only created a culture of rampant fraud but undermined trust in neighbors and government caused almost entirely by this one immigrant group.
Unfortunately it's very politically incorrect if we then follow the implications. As someone who has lived on three continents and am multicultural, my lived experience suggests to me that you're more or less correct. Smart immigration policy would however require discrimination and we're back to the politically incorrect. It's such a shame we live in such a hyperbolic ideological era. Keep up the good work!
This is nice, but it ignores the rhinoceros in the living room. Typical of economics, which is mired in "ancestor worship". Yes we have some of the old immigration issues, relatively minor culture clashes over food and such.
The overwhelming problem of our time is that we are in a civil war with Islam. Right now in the White House and NYC, and to some extent Congress (the squad), we see the effect of Islamic culture's skill at corruption, conspiracy, subterfuge, implicit and explicit terrorism, and lying to pursue its dictates of total war. I refer to Mamdani's cover story that he is a socialist, while he pursues jihad and fully supports all Muslim terrorism. I refer to the corruption of billions in "business deals" given to Trump’s family and friends. (Donald Trump Jr, Jared Kushner, and Zach Witkoff. Steve Witkoff was corrupted 10 years ago with $627 million of Qatari money for his hotel. Note that this was done with Steve Witkoff when Trump entered the political scene.)
The utter incapacity of academics, particularly economists to see and address what actually matters is demonstrated here in this article. We are in a civil war. Islamic ideology and culture must be identified and cast out violently.
I know that you pride yourself on your courage, Garrett that, itself, should give all of us grave pause. Because academia is shot through with revolutionaries (well, wannabe revolutionaries) seeking to buff up their street creds. Those teach the young elite. And that shapes America.
Your milieu Garrett, has been corrupted for a long time, acquired by Qatari money. In the real world unfolding outside your windows, your courage relative to your peers is like comparing a mouse that explores 6" from his home to one that explores 3" and congratulating that amazing mouse!
But it’s clearly racist and dishonest in many places.
First, the great migration was TERRIBLE for the north. Detroit and all the other burnt out rust belt cities are examples of the damage the great migration did. Minneapolis could have been a Scandanvians paradise, instead it gave us George Floyd. The blacks moved north and brought crime, welfarism, and extremely corrupt and incompetent urban political machines.
The confederate diaspora? I note that the sunbelt is the emblem of growth and freedom that people are flocking to today to flee northern dysfunction (brought about by immigrants making them one party states).
The north absolutely would have been better off if the great migration never happened. L
Full paper that it’s loosely based on here: https://www.dropbox.com/scl/fi/9hgmnrl30l7ptt9e5rz7y/Migration-as-a-Culture-Transplant_Garett_Jones_GMU.pdf?rlkey=4dhiz50p41wshsbwsyvom6g2c&dl=0
The idea that values persist acros generations is critical here. Looking at the neo-Europe examples, its clear that institutions dont just emerge from geography or resources alone but from the people who build them. The spaghetti theory resonates because we do meet in the midlle more often than we fully asimilate. Policy makers should weigh both individual credentials and ancestral outcomes when considering immigration.
I don't think you need to coin the phrase “The Spaghetti Theory of Cultural Change” when a very famous term already exists for what you're describing: The Melting-Pot. This is indeed one of the great virtues of immigration, which is why the term is generally perceived with such a positive valence.
More from me on the history of the term “The Melting-Pot” and its virtues: https://www.wetheblacksheep.com/p/the-forgotten-american-masterpiece
Actually I did need to coin the phrase because as I note in Culture Transplant the term Melting Pot is now a dead metaphor: it now only means assimilation by immigrants to the new nation's norms.
Sometimes you have to acknowledge that a once-great line is now a dead expression.
And Spaghetti Theory highlights the reverse assimilation effect, which needs highlighting.
I'm glad that Dwarkesh brought it up on his podcast with Henrich, for example.
One does not need to do extensive studies to see that smart immigration policy is superior to the development or even survival of a nation. One needs only look at the benefit/harm that individual immigrants bring to their local families and communities. Ask any American or European who married someone who practices Sharia law and they will tell you that Islam not only does NOT make America better, it actually undermines our nation while harming those involved. One can then look at the nations around the Mediterranean before and after the Arab invasions and forced conversions to Islam and see that most of the effects on these societies were profoundly negative. One could do a study on the settlement of large numbers of Somalis in Minnesota has not only created a culture of rampant fraud but undermined trust in neighbors and government caused almost entirely by this one immigrant group.
Texas better put up a Californians Go Home sign on the border!
False.
Blue State Exiles are actually pretty right wing overall.
Unfortunately it's very politically incorrect if we then follow the implications. As someone who has lived on three continents and am multicultural, my lived experience suggests to me that you're more or less correct. Smart immigration policy would however require discrimination and we're back to the politically incorrect. It's such a shame we live in such a hyperbolic ideological era. Keep up the good work!
Thanks, Stefano!
This is a fascinating area of study. I did not know it existed before this.
I am an immigrant to the US. And I like to think I am contributing in multiple positive ways to my adopted country.
I'm sure you are! My focus is overwhelmingly on the 2nd generation and beyond.
The first generation immigrant walks on water, the later generations like me walk on the dry earth.
This is nice, but it ignores the rhinoceros in the living room. Typical of economics, which is mired in "ancestor worship". Yes we have some of the old immigration issues, relatively minor culture clashes over food and such.
The overwhelming problem of our time is that we are in a civil war with Islam. Right now in the White House and NYC, and to some extent Congress (the squad), we see the effect of Islamic culture's skill at corruption, conspiracy, subterfuge, implicit and explicit terrorism, and lying to pursue its dictates of total war. I refer to Mamdani's cover story that he is a socialist, while he pursues jihad and fully supports all Muslim terrorism. I refer to the corruption of billions in "business deals" given to Trump’s family and friends. (Donald Trump Jr, Jared Kushner, and Zach Witkoff. Steve Witkoff was corrupted 10 years ago with $627 million of Qatari money for his hotel. Note that this was done with Steve Witkoff when Trump entered the political scene.)
The utter incapacity of academics, particularly economists to see and address what actually matters is demonstrated here in this article. We are in a civil war. Islamic ideology and culture must be identified and cast out violently.
I know that you pride yourself on your courage, Garrett that, itself, should give all of us grave pause. Because academia is shot through with revolutionaries (well, wannabe revolutionaries) seeking to buff up their street creds. Those teach the young elite. And that shapes America.
Your milieu Garrett, has been corrupted for a long time, acquired by Qatari money. In the real world unfolding outside your windows, your courage relative to your peers is like comparing a mouse that explores 6" from his home to one that explores 3" and congratulating that amazing mouse!
Bravo for the work overall.
But it’s clearly racist and dishonest in many places.
First, the great migration was TERRIBLE for the north. Detroit and all the other burnt out rust belt cities are examples of the damage the great migration did. Minneapolis could have been a Scandanvians paradise, instead it gave us George Floyd. The blacks moved north and brought crime, welfarism, and extremely corrupt and incompetent urban political machines.
The confederate diaspora? I note that the sunbelt is the emblem of growth and freedom that people are flocking to today to flee northern dysfunction (brought about by immigrants making them one party states).
The north absolutely would have been better off if the great migration never happened. L